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HomeMy WebLinkAbout1993-02-11 Airport Commission SummaryRHRAI AIRPMT CONKISSION February 11, 1993 City Hall Council Chambers 1. ROLL CALL Commissioners present: Bob Scott, Bonnie Roerber, sill Toppa, Teresa Wormer-Quade, Phil Mee Also present: Ready Brest, Airport I�eR Loretta Harvey, lim"aribinq eeorstary a. Election of Officers Toppa asked for volunteers for Chairman and Vice -Chairman. Seeing none, he opened the meeting to nominations. Bob Scott nominated Bill Toppa for Chairman and asked that nominations be closed. Ames seconded. Toppa nominated Bob Scott. Koerber seconded. Toppa was elected Chairman by unanimous vote and made Scott Vice -Chair. P�Ul * S ewe] WiTej zz Addition to agenda: Pam Hansen under Persons Present Scheduled to be Heard. a. Kenai Airport Business Alliance Catherine Delacee Toppa introduced Delacee. Delacee - Good evening and thank you for affording us the opportunity to introduce ourselves. I an this evening's spokesperson for the Kenai Airport Business Alliance (KARA). I know that you received our statement of philosophy in your meeting packets so I'm not going to be redundant. I know it's been a long day for everyone. As noted in our statement we are comprised of 12 local businesses in the airport and we are diverse in the nature of our goods and services. But interdependent in our desire to fully serve the travel public and community and in making the airport user friendly. As we advised the Council last week, we are here to request a commitment to cooperation and coordination and a united effort in developing a mutually beneficial working partnership. KENAI AIRPORT COMMISSION Meeting - February 11, 1993 Page 2 With the untimely passing of City Manager Bill Brighton and resulting vacancy in that office of City ministration we view your role as adviser to the City Council and Airport manager as being expanded and reinforced. We no longer have his (Brighton's) sympathetic efforts on Airport operations and regulations. Therefore this intermediate avenue of appeal o n daily airport procedures and operations has been closed to use. Councilwoman Monfor suggested that the Council and Airport Commission meet with the BABA to roll up our selves and address our mutual ideas and concerns. It is our suggestion that such a work session be scheduled for March 3rd. Than is Council night and that would either be before or after, depending on people ' s abilities to attend. It is our hope that you will be in agreement so the Alliance may request a work session at the February 17th Council meeting. If you have any questions I'll try. As you can see in our statement we've got this tremendous pool of resources with the twelve businesses, with our daily activity at the airport. We have alot of ideas just to make the airport user friendly and to increase revenues, not only for us, because that is a direct result in increased revenues to the city. So we had hoped to do this, we're in this for the long haul. We're getting all our paperwork together, in a professional manner, and we're in the process of getting all our ideas in a format which we can present to you. After discussion the Commission and Alliance decided to recommend to Council a work session for March 3rd at 6:00 p.m. Delaaee - Added that the Alliance will have at least an hour's worth of discussion. The plan is to bring in plans and proposals in hard copy. And in our discussions we realize that everyone has attorneys and they would need them to look over things to see if they can be done, etc. b. Pam Hansen - Making Kenai a Nonsmoking Airport * * *V=Mffri[* * * Ranson - My name is Pamela Hansen, I appeared before the Council at their last meeting and requested a smoke -free environment for the Kenai Airport. And they requested that I appear before the Commission with my case. So that is why I'm here before the Commission tonight "with my case." Each of you has the book put our by the DEC, you may follow along if you like or just sit back and I'll read it to you. KENAI AIRPORT COMMISSION Meeting - February 11, 1993 Page 3 If you turn to page 8 you'll see that this is the laws of Alaska for HCS CSSB 222 introduced by Hess. It was approved by the Governor May 16, 1990, after it was amended and the actual effective date was August 14, 1990. If you'll turn to page 9 you'll see that it's an act relating to smoking in certain vehicles and indoor places. "Findings. The leg4s] attire finds that: (1) numerous studies have shown second- hand smoke to be a significant health hazard." If you follow down to section 18.35.300 Places where smoking is regulated: "Smoking in any form is a nuisance and a public health hazard and is prohibited in the following vehicles and indoor places," except as allowed under AS 18.35.310: (1) "A vehicle of public transportation and a waiting baggage, or boarding area for a vehicle of public transportation, including a bus, ferry vessel, train, limousine for hire, taxicab, or scheduled interstate or intrastate aircraft flight when consistent with federal law, if you turn to page 11 under section 18.35.320 Designation of smoking sections. (a) A person in charge of an indoor place or vehicle of public transportation described in AS 18.35.300 may designate portions of the place or vehicle as smoking sections. Fallow down under (c): "A person who designates a smoking section under this section shall make reasonable accommodations to protect the health of the nonsmokers who use the place or vehicle by separation, partition, or ventilation that ensures that nonsmokers in the place or vehicle are not subject to the active by-products of smoke from smokers in the place or vehicle." Now if you'll turn to page 2 Where Smoking is Regulated: (1) Public Transportation waiting or boarding areas. (2) Public transportation vehicles, including: Interstate and Intrastate aircraft. So now turn to page 4, Nonsmokers rights: "The law establishes that your right to clean, smoke -free air supersedes the right of smokers in certain places. These areas must be identified by large, conspicuously placed signs. If the person in charge designates a smoking area, he or she must protect your health by ensuring that you are not exposed to second-hand smoke. If this cannot be achieved by separation, partition or ventilation, then the area must remain nonsmoking." Now if you'll got to page 5: "In places and vehicles where smoking is egg t�,ed,. you may designate a gor%ion (but not ail) of the place or vehicle as a smoking area. If you designate a smoking area, you must make reasonable accommodations to protect the health of nonsmokers who use the place or vehicle by separation, partition KENAI AIRPORT COMMISSION Meeting - February 11, 1993 Page 4 or ventilation that ensures that nonsmokers in the place or vehicle are not subject to second-hand smoke from smokers. If no reasonable accommodations can be made, for whatever reason, the nonsmoking designation requirement prevails." Now if you go to page 6 the very last paragraph: "When designating a portion of a place as smoking, it is recommended that a separated room, with a sedate ventilation system directly vented to the outside, be provided." Is there, may I ask, one ventilation serving the whole building at the airport? Or dots it have several? Ernst - I think there are at least two. The Restaurant has its own and the bar, of course, and there's one by the gift shop and one by the ticket counters and there's one in the back area also. Reason - so there's actually four. And basically if that cannot be done where it's vented to the outside, and that can't be provided than if you go back to page 6 again "reasonable accommodations can be made for whatever reason than nonsmoking requirement, prevails." With your description the main body of the airport than is served by one, the baggage area, the check -in area the telephones the two entrances and exits of the building are served by the same ventilation system? Ernst - there is one by the gift shop and there's one by the ticket counters. Xqnsen - what separates these ventilation systems? I mean there are no walls, there are no barriers, so basically it's one open area and. both ventilation systems are sucking in that same pollutant. So basically they're not protected or set aside areas. I. believe that the intent of the law is pretty clear that the main body of the Kenai Airport be smoke -free throughout. I know that the State is cutting back on funds, and your all hurting for money and you're trying to stretch budgets and every piece of information that I've been able to pick up states that you have decreased insurance premiums when you have smoke -free buildings. And you also have cheaper maintenance and cleaning bills. So it will have more than just that one benefit. But I truly believe that the time has come to fly into the nineties and make the Main body a smoke -free area if not the whole building, and if you chose to have other areas they must be sealed of areas. For instance: the restaurant if they use that as a smoking area the door must remain closed. And same thing with the bar so that the smoke cannot drift into other parts of the airport and be picked up by the ventilation system. KENAI AIRPORT COMMISSION Meeting - February 11, 1993 Page 5 There is a little flyer in here that the EPA sent me with some information. Itpertains to restaurants but because of the size of the Kenai Airport I think it would be very equitable. It states: "don't be foaled you cannot have a smoking and nonsmoking section side by side with the sow ventilation system." It's like trying to have a chlorine free section of a swimming pool and we all know we can't do Chet. And it definitely is toxic. Second hand smoke has some of the same poisons as the air around toxic waste dusts. So I would'areciate it, if you would take to heart what the law intent is and ice the building, the main portions that everyone uses, smoke free. Thank you. Toppa - Thank you. The airport is currently posted according with the no smoking and a designated smoking area? Ernst - Right. Toppa - That part has been done but has anyone researched the ventilation portion of it, do you know? Ernst - Well I guess that Administration feels that the way it's setup now it allows for smoking areas in the most ventilated areas in the airport. Toppa - Does anyone have any comments? Randy you've listened to the presentation and looked at the law and been to the airport. How often do you receive complaints about the smoking situation at the airport? Ernst - I've only received, actually people coming up to me and saying, Mrs. Hansen is the only one to come public and say that. In the eight years I've been there maybe three, it just hasn't been very many. Just as a point of interest, I've had a few phone calls since the article in the paper and that pretty much, and that can be skewed since people get their coa-litions together and want to make their point. i just want to say that out of the ones I did get the majority wanted to leave the airport as is. I had nine people call me and out of the nine, seven of those wanted to leave it as is. I went through the terminal and talked to the various agencies car rental people and their consensus was that they preferred to be able to smoke if they're going to be there all day. Toppa - we've gone through that same thing in the federal workplace and we've come to the same conclusion that the only way to have a smoke -free environment is to have the smoking area a separate room vented directly to the outside. Maybe we should recommend to the council that they look into just how much smoke is dispersed there. There's ways to sample the air there, I don't know how expensive that is, but if we're not in compliance with the law we should find out just how much is going on there. KENAI AIRPORT COMMISSION Meeting - February 11, 1993 Page 6 Hansen - May I make one more comment? There have been many times that myself, and other people would have liked to have complained. Alot of ,people don't Meow where your (Ernst) office is. Its not very accessible and you're not always there. And not everyone is as verbal as I an, but whenever the subject comes up it's predominately that people prefer it not be a smoking area. The calls that you received and the people that work at the airport, I don't know if you've over watched but it's a .blue cloud over there where they rent cars. Because % everybody skbkes over there and everybody's gonna guawdi that thing. The fart is, the wad► I read the lawj you're not in compliance. And you have to be in compliance. If those people want to saok* theyfre going to have go to a separate room, because you're not protecting me. when I go in to buy a ticket, to board a plane to come back to pick up my baggage and to exit the door. I cannot come in or out either door of that airport without passing a polluted area which is on the same ventilation System as the smoking area. flank you. Hoerber - said she disagreed that there was a blue cloud near the car rental booths. :the could see how it would be offensive but there were only three people who smoked. After further discussion Toppa asked that this item be addressed again under 6 a. New Business. a. October 15, 1992 - Approved as presented. a. Advertising Campaign Werner-Quade - Elaine Wood from Pilgrim Advertising had presented a advertising plan at a previous meeting. Since that meeting Werner -Quads had met with Wood and she had come up with a new proposal which cut the cost from the original proposal of $22,000 to $11,000. This included a classified ad, in the Anchorage Daily News for 5,000 and a postcard mail -out to selected pilots incorporating the free -pass. That's a free pass either for the weekend or the season. Werner -Quads - Recommended that the Commission trim the advertising budget to about $5, 000 and just go for the classified ad in the Daily News. This would give the Commission a chance to see what kind of return this ad would bring and than proceed with other advertising methods through Pilgrim Advertising. KENAI AIRPORT COMMISSION Meeting - February 11, 1993 Page 7 NOW= AM VOTE: AIM MOM TO @G RIITR TU CLA"ZIIED AD. RMRTBR-QUADR 8800NDZD. P"SX0DM iLY. b. Marking Lines at Airport - Dean Eichholz To"* - Asked if Commission members had anything new to report on this item? He reported that he had spoken to Airport's Division people and they were not aware there was an extra line there. Many airports have this line to indicate a vehicle roadway and there are no regulations regarding this. * *vbRDll►TIN* * Deena $iehhmis - I'm Dean Eichholz, Alaska Flying Network, President of Alaska frying Network. I came in October and presented a problem that I saw out there at the airport with these driving lines and at the time I recommended that the advisory council here take a look at removing those limes or doing something with them. There was alot of discussion about the lines being there. Since then, after having done some research on those lines and looking at some other airports, there are some recommendations from other airports in the way the lines are designed at other airports. Rather than running right up against the fence and right between where Southcentral, ERA, and Mark Air park at the terminal building so everybody has to go across the access road and in front of the terminal. Maybe the access road could be further out on the ramp the uncontrolled area runs 100 feet or so out away from that fence and from the terminal building and at that point that would alleviate alot of the problems between the cars and the airplanes. it would also, like I say, the airplanes would be able to park. You wouldn't have the problem of people disembarking off an airplane and trying to get into the terminal building and having to cross that access road. Or having the airplanes when the conditionals are like such, where the ramp gets very slick out there the airplane can taxi ai little closer to the terminal building and disembark the passengers with less danger to them. Further down on the ramp where our area is located Everett's Air Fuel also does a lot of cargo hauling and fuel hauling from that area. And they're concerned with that because they have a fork- lift that bulk loads their airplane and it has to avoid that road and it would be better is that road was on the other side of their airplane. And they have sent a letter which I could give the copy to you, if you would to have a copy, just to point out some of the items they had to say on that, because they were quit concerned KENAI AIRPORT COMMISSION Meeting - February 11, 1993 Page 8 with that. They said moving the aircraft further out toward the active tax -way increases the possibility of an unanticipated accident. There are times, in the winter months, when the Kenai Airport taxi- ways are covered with ice. It makes taxiing a large aircraft extremely difficult if the wind is blowing. Having plenty of taxi- way allows for a safe operation. Everett air fuel is not the only company that operates large aircraft into Kenai. In comparison to other airports the vehicle access road is not located on the edge of the tarmac. It is located in an area where immediate access is available without unusual obstacles in and around the designated roadway. Even if our airport were parked fifteen feet from the designated access road this would not provide enough distance for fast moving vehicles in an emergency situation. They went on to say in the interest of airport safety I cannot stress the importance of re-evaluating the entire situation and pushing ahead for a more logical solution. Since the problem is and has been a long-term problem the solution should be directed toward whatever safety dictates. Signed, Robert Everett, Vice President. Toppa - Do you have a recommendation of where that road should go? Hichhols - Many of in Anchorage they separation between the other places such put it further out the taxi -way and the as Fairbanks and even up there toward where the Toppa - I did talk to the Airports Division people and they did say that all over the country those roads run normally through the middle of the ramp and there a distance from the ramp and the taxi- way. And they're just designed where they have a distance. Even people familiar with airports get lost and end up on the ramp, which happens occasionally. They actually end up staying between those lines because it's a common thing for them to do. 8iahhol$ - It's a real common problem out here with as many people who taxi up there and try to park the airplane. Of course, as close out of the way as they can and of course, if they're parked just outside, for instance, our airplanes outside of the Flying Network, than they're parked right on that roadway. It happened two or three times today with different transient airplanes. Toppa - Does the Commission, has anybody got any idea of the line he's talking about, or have an idea what it would look like? Have you Bonnie? Roorbor - I think we ought to make an apology to him, because when he was here last time he asked all of, each and every one of us to go out and see what he was talking about. He mentioned the other day . . . KENAI AIRPORT COMMISSION Meeting - February 11, 1993 Page 9 Toppa - Well since he was here though, it's been covered with snow. We could see where the lines were now anyway. You could make a drawing on the board to show us what you're talking about. ai+abbols - You like my artistic talent? (Drew diagram on chalkboard) Basically we have the runway 1 and 1-9 in Kenai we have a couple of different taxiway areas off the runway and Taxi- way Bravo and Taxi -way Alpha are the main areas of concern and it would go on down here to the taxi -ways. What we have here is a separation between the ramp area and the taxi area. The ramp area has some taxi lines where this is controlled from the tourer, this area over here is a designated ramp area and it's uncontrolled as far as the tower's perspective. Further over and straight off the Bravo exit is the office where my business of course is located here. The first one, Alaska Flying Network, but than there's several different office► right here that Mark Air has there freight office and ERA, bHL all have their freight offices right here. My planes are parked out in here, which is, of course, well out of the ramp area and down here, better continue on with my drawing here. Right here we have the terminal building the aircraft that come from Anchorage, that park out here for off-loading, park out here in front of the terminal building to off-load passengers. South Central has a certain area and Mark Air and ERA. The road that we're discussing right here, there's a, right now the road I'm bring up runs right here, just outside the fence area the access area to the airport from Willow Street is located between the terminal building and the freight offices. There's a gate right here and puts you right onto the ramp. Vehicles that would come on to here, if they were to drive down here in front of the terminal, they would have to drive in front of the passengers getting off the plane and the terminal building. WE have a fuel facility located in this area right here and many of the transient planes that will come in for charts, or directions or fuel when they come in to the airport there for flight checks, I'm the examiner for the whole Peninsula so when people come in from Seward, or Soldotna, Homer or whatever. They'll come in and park their airplane and as I mentioned we have our airplanes right here. They'll come up and generally park right outside our airplanes and come in for their checkrite or we have different transient airplanes that show up. One, that came to my attention, that I brought before the Council last October was when the Arco jet showed up and he parked right here and his wing tip exceeded that line as he was parked in the ramp area right here. By moving this road out closer to this separation than the traffic that would come out from Willow Street or whatever would be well separated from the... KENAI AIRPORT COMMISSION Meeting - February 11, 1993 Page 10 Toppa - Now the traffic that goes out there, who belongs on there? hichhols - The only traffic for example that you'll see out here is people for instant SC freight will drive right out here to service an airplane. The people from Mark Air down here or SRA they come straight across over off r6a p three. We're not talking about this being a road where if you want to visit the airport you can drive out on. Toppa - So the people who come through that gate are authorized people. What about the people who own general aviation airplanes? Would they . . . Eicuhhols - They don't have any business out there either. General Aviation park at the other end of the airport. They park down at this end anyway and there is a gate at this end that they go in and out of. Toppa - So we're talking about vehicles that have business on the airport. Anyone who's on there should be trained to know where the vehicle lines are, where to drive. Sichhols - And where the problem comes, like I said is when the transient airplanes come in there and they try to park here near these other airplanes to stay out of the way. As Everett's stated in their letter and what has happened here as of late there has to be parking further out here, closer to the taxi area but now we have larger airplanes, like a DC-6 that comes in here and have ERA's Convair and now we're getting less separation of these airplanes. Toppa - What's the estimation of vehicles that go by there in say a two to three hour period. Do you see a few everyday or what? Eiohhols - Randy. I see go back and forth when he checks . other than that, I don't, we don't have, you know any traffic. Like I say the only traffic that we have down in this area that I know of is Everett's when they're servicing their airplanes. ToWa - You'd think if the lines were changed that this would solve the problem? Nichhols - This would solve alot of the problem. Toppa - You could still have a vehicle area . . . Biahhols - We could still have a vehicle area, like I say people are blocking this roadway. KENAI AIRPORT COMMISSION Meeting - February 11, 1993 Page 11 Toppa. - It seems like, I don't know if it was originally designed when that line was first laid out there was some thought as to keeping it separated. I know what I've seen from other airports that those roads are not running along the fence. They are going outside. 8iobhols - An emergency vehicle of course it would come through here isn't going to make that kind of corner anyway. wessec-Quade - I just had a comment, that when you came last time and you explained your position, I was under the impression that you have come before and explained the position and there was a safety issue. A►nd so, maybe I'm the only one that was under the opinion that it was, that we had decided that the line wasn't going to be moved. But, however, I'm glad that you came back and that you're changing your position again, because we really didn't know whet it was that you exactly wanted. But I just wanted you to know that when you came last time that we had decided. Toppa - By the way, I talked to the tower manager, the new tower manager about that and they had no comments because it doesn't affoct them. It's still uncontrolled, wherever you put that control. As far as the safety issue they don't consider it a safety issue. Eiohhols - The only thing that happens, once again alot of the problems come from the transient pilots, because the transient that taxis in here, especially with the larger airplane will ask the tower where he can park and they say anywhere in this area is fine. They pull in and inadvertently they're going to pull in fairly close because if we have, for instance the Arco jet their going to be met with a rental car or the limousine from a motel. And they're gonna just pull out here to service that. Ames - I wonder why the tower, right after our last meeting, I talked to the guys at the tower and they didn't seem to have a strong opinion on it. I could see where the lines were at and I can see what Randy's talking about and I can see what you're talking about. I wonder why the lines were put there in the first place? And now that they're there I don't see a real need for taking them off. I think the whole area would be better off with no lines. Because a man taxiing an airplane is not a drunk driver out here on the highway on Friday night. Randy might be the exception. (laughter) He doesn't go out there wheeling around out there very much intoxicated. But anyway I really thing that the whole area there could be better utilized if there wasn't any lines there. Toppa - There not required by airport now. Airports like here where they decide they have to have them. KENAI AIRPORT COMMISSION Meeting - February 11, 1993 Page 12 Eichhols - The only people that drive out in this area have business with an airplane out here. Believe me, anybody that drives out in this area that don't have business with either a comergcial airplanes right here or an airplane out here is going to be Queried, by myself or some other business. Toppa - Would you consider if the lines were moved it might be better? Should they be there at all? Siobhols - If you ask my opinion I don't see that there's a reason for the lines right there. But there again if we're talking about a liability thing and you want a line I would say to move it out so that it's separating the airplanes further. i think it's more dangerous for the fact of trying to push the airplanes farther our onto the tarmac for reasons down here in front of the building also. We're talking about with the icy conditions that we have out there right now I don't think I'd 'want my passengers to go an extra ten or fifteen steps to go in or out of the terminal building. You sure wouldn't want a car driving in front of it right at it. Toppa - Other questions, Bob? Scott - Did I miss understand you last time? I see this time your wanting the sign moved out . . . Eichholz - Last time I just asked for it to be removed. Since the last time I've researched it if you want lines let us move them, so that we do separate them from . . . Verner -Quad* - It does seem to be a little clearer this time around than it was last time but I just wanted to ask Randy what he thought, or his concern for safety because that was what was paramount last time? That there was a safety issue at hand. And maybe your solution of moving that line would commiserate for that. What do you think about that line, Randy? Ernst - Well there are alot of ramifications for the, and reasons for the roadway being there and I've outlined it to you in the past and I can do it again. But I think because Mr. Eichholz and Mr. Pitts have retained legal council and that is part of the issue I think we might need to meet with them in that legal capacity instead of trying to resolve it here. Werner -Quads - Oh, I see, okay, thanks. Toppa - Well it doesn't negate some recommendations, we can make some recommendations on it. Does anyone have any comment on that, should be just let the legal end of it hassle it? KENAI AIRPORT COMMISSION Meeting - February 11, 1993 Page 13 aoott - I wish that he would have said when he come up here that there had been legal council brought into this. I did not know that and because of that I would not make a recommendation without his or the tity's counsel. I don't think that's right. - Is there any other opinions on that? What exactly is the legal counsel? What's going on with that? Mmot - Well were down to writing letters back and forth and that's the only mode of communications that's allowed at this point. And we have, we have sent letters to his counsel and they have returned letters to us. The last letter I believe they said they were sanding to Mr. Eichholz. So, I think it's best, all around being taken care of by our Attorney and theirs. Worner-Qua6o - Well yes, because it becomes somewhat of a muddled issue when you know he's here again and it's the same type of a thing that it was last time. And we went through it and you did explain the safety thing and we had opinions about it then. And so now, as far as I know this is the third time Mr. Eichholz is asking about this same problem. Toppa - Is this the third time Dean, that you've been here? Eiabbols - This is the second time I've been here. I came in October. Toppa - I was not aware of any legal action that was being taken. What exactly? Oh, you can't talk at this time, I don't understand that actually. Mike Eandatske - Would you like more testimony about the line? Toppa - I don't know if it's going to do us any good if it's a legal problem. We could still make some recommendations I think. That's what the Commission is here for, if the lawyer wants to counsel us . . . Anon - I'd like to hear what that gentleman has to say. Toppa - Okay Mike go ahead. Xan4atske - My name is Mike Kredatzke, I'm an insurance broker who happens to also fly and use the airport. Most of my clients use the Kenai airport. I would like to relate an instance that I heard about from a client in Anchorage. He owns an Anchorage air taxi operation and was tankering fuel from Kenai to the west side of the Cook Inlet. Repeatedly his hired pilot was directed to repark his aircraft, apparently he was sitting on this roadway that Dean drew. Now, I don't know how many of you folks are pilots. it probably KENAI AIRPORT COMMISSION Meeting - February 11, 1993 Page 14 doesn't matter, but an airport is for aircraft, in my opinion. And shq►uld accommodate aircraft as such as possible. When you come into a strmqe airport not knowing the local situation you do what you know is best. I think you parkaway from moving aircraft. If you see other aircraft near close by you'll probably park by those aircraft. If you see a terminal, the t6w►er tells you to park north of the terminal building, yom'ro probably going to park asw<'close as you can to the barrier fence separatina the airport from the city, away from the taxi areas. Ate' unfart attaly, that's right where this roadway is. So I guess, I don't known if that helps you guys make a decision or a recommendation tonight. But it has been an ongoing problem and it's kinda surrisinsg 'how small the aviation community is and how fast wbrd gents around. Toppa - Well, thank you Mike. I don't know how much money legal counsel is going to be involved in this and what the City is willing to pay for a simple line bashing moved and what the safety issue is. And I don't know why this Commission is together if we're not able t make recommendations on 'what testimony we heard here. Now if anybody wants to make a comment on that I would appreciate it. soerber - I would just like to make the comment that they were here before and I had we understood what they were speaking of the first time than they probably wouldn't have had a 1`egal problem. Toppa - I'm in agreement with that. Werner -Quads - Because the first time it was to remove that line. Toppa - Well we are able to make recommendations. Whether the Council wants to go by it or not it's up to them. What I've heard so far I can see that they have a very good place, if we had heard at the last meeting it may have been different. You're a Commission appointed by the city to make recommendations and you might want to take the opportunity to mention what you feel about it. Warner -Quads - Well based on the testimony of these fellows who use this all the time it sounds like the line needs to be moved. I haven't seen the line I've only talked to Randy who pointed out it would be a dangerous situation to remove the line, that was brought up on October 15th. Now we're like gonna move the line and that's alot different from taking it away completely. You know, based on what ]lave said, maybe we should just spay yes let's just move the line. Toppa - Mould you like to make a motion regarding moving the line? KENAI AIRPORT COMMISSION Meeting - February 11, 1993 Page 15 werne�r-Q e - The only reason that I am hesitant to do so is because I don't feel like I have any support really. Toppa - Well if you get a second, than we'll know, if you don't than you won't. Would you like to make a comment? Sign in please. Bryan Holland - My name is Bryan Holland, I am a pilot, I am an aircraft mechanic, and I work for the City of Kenai. I spend 90% of my time Working on the airport and I have one problem with the suggestion of moving it out on the ramp. And this is the problem with it. You have the people that work that drive back and forth with fork -lifts and those type items are a different type people from your pilots. They are not trained, they are not understanding of the hazards. Toppa - You're saying that we have people who are working on this ramp that are not trained to be on the ramp? Holland - Not to the quality that you have as pilots. These people do not have radios with them many times. They are in an uncontrolled area, they are not required to have radios. but they do not have radios many times and they are not in contact with the tower. Sometimes they have radios and they are in contact with their base. many times the tower does give advice to those that are in an uncontrolled area also. in bad weather conditions. These are people, many of my jobs at the Kenai airport are repairs because of their not knowing or not being careful. many times the overhead door is run over, doors get slammed and doors get tore up from these type people. Now I'm not saying anything against them in particular, but they are not as cautious as our pilots are. Toppa - You're saying than that they are careless individuals? Holland - In some respects they are. Not all of them, but there are a few of them that are careless in there actions. And for me to see them out on the ramp right next to a controlled area line is a big mistake. I work on that ramp everyday and I see what foes on out there. And I hate to bring it up, but when we start talking about moving it out, out there I think it would be a big problem for the City and we really need to look at this. ]saes - How would you feel about no line at all? Holland - If it came down to no line or moving the line out, i would say no line. But you have to consider also that, that line is placed there because the ramp was a public use ramp. Business is supposed to be conducted on the property of the users of the leased property. They cross that line coming and going from the public use area. And i can understand why that line is there and it needs to be used if the lease property is set up properly also. KENAI AIRPORT COMMISSION Meeting - February 11, 1993 Page 17 Toppa - At this point we'll take a short recess, get a cup of coffee and we'll resume on this. 5 MINUTE RECESS Toppa - Called the meeting back to order. MOTION i VOTE: SCOTT 4 MOM TO TRUE TOR BUBJM DUN TO LEGAL COUNSEL IS INVOLVMENT ISS19E . - Ems. PAMM SLY. so . a. Making Kenai a Non -Smoking Airport Toppa - Suggested that research be done to see it the City is in compliance with the law. Resaer-Qvade - Volunteered to help Ernst investigate whether the Kenai Municipal Airport is in compliance with State laws. Toppa - Asked that they report back on this item at the next meeting. 7. . AIRPORT MMAGER'S REPORT a. Projects Update - Attached to minutes a. Letter of Resignation - Brian Shackleton Toppa noted the letter of resignation from Shackleton in the Airport packet. Ames notified the Commission that he would also be resigning after this meeting. Toppa thanked Ames for his dedication and service to the community. There being no further business the meeting was adjourned at approximately 8:30 p.m. Respe tfully s witted, Loretta rvey Transcribing Secretary KENAI AIRPORT COMMISSION Meeting - February 11, 1993 Page 16 Anew - Nobody would be isolated if there was a line through it. i feel this way about it. Anywhere inside that fence any airplane has the right of way over any normal road vehicle any time. And an emergency regardless of whether it's Randy running out to do something that has to be done immediately, a crash truck, fire truck, ambulance, they are not going to be going down that road, they are going to go straight to wherever they're going. So I really don't see the need for the line being there. I don't have any objection to them being there but I just don't see any need of them. Mere we are for what? Six, eight months you can't even see them anyway. I haven't been over there since the snow but you could see tbma good enough in October. I really didn't see how they were creating a big problem. i saw a DC-3 sitting right across the middle of it and I didn't really see a logical place where he would be where he could not be sitting across it. Toppa - Sounds to me with the testimony you gave, that if we have anybody driving near the ramp that are careless they shouldn't be near the ramp anyway. I think that's one thing we should look into right away and make a recommendation to Council to find who is qualified to be on that ramp right now and what training they're receiving. I happen to know that FAA requires that training be provided. If there is something going on there maybe we need to look into that. Lines - We have teenagers working out there. Toppa - Than they need to be trained. Shirley Roberts - They are trained but that doesn't mean your gonna do that job as well as you are trained. Toppa - Than the supervisors should be out there checking on the qualifications and the continuing training of those people. Roberts - Randy does his job too, as far as controlling that area. And I can identify with what Bryan, being out there on the ramps for as long as I've been. I can understand Jean's part where he's been. But being out there in that area where your terminal is, if you don't have those guidelines for those people I think it will be utter chaos on that ramp out there. Somebody could just decide we can just drive in between all of this. Toppa - That's not what they're saying. That's not the deal the way I understand it. Thank you. Commission did you want to . . .? Verner -Quad* - I think it answered my question in the course of the discussion.